2 One evening, David got up from his couch and was pacing back and forth on the roof of the palace. Practically, I have helped the authors of DTT website and after I have done that, Im gonna deal with websites like wikiIslam and answering islam. Died at 70 years of age. To make matters worse, we need to allow at least 18 months (two pregnancies) between Davids first encounter with Bathsheba and Solomons birth (2 Samuel 11), which means that Bathsheba was around 79 years old at the time. First, the account in Chronicles omits the sordid stories of David and Bathsheba and Absaloms revolt, and only mentions some characters in passing, so we do not have much information about Bathsheba, Eliam, or Ahithophel. She was two years old, on our scheme, when David became king. In what two situations was Bathsheba caught, and how did she respond in each? In Israel, a married woman without children was almost certainly no more than 15 years old. [105] This agrees with Biblical standards as well. [45] John MacArthur, The MacArthur Bible Commentary (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005), p. 636. This was also the conclusion of Jewish and Christian commentators. Nathans rebuke places the entire blame on David, and not on Bathsheba. This illustrates that Ahithophel was probably a young man (Source: This brings us to the most crucial point of our academic journey of determining Ahithophels age. Note that the Bible describes Bathsheba at this time as very beautiful (2 Samuel 11:2) and David was overcome with feelings of lust for her! Tomorrow Ill send you back. So Uriah stayed in Jerusalem that day. We will use two main sources for this: 2 Samuel and Psalm 55 (though other books will also be used). According to the chronology of 2 Samuel 1315, two years had passed since Amnon had raped his half-sister Tamar (Absaloms sister), Thus, the Talmud sages did not left out the 4 years that went by between Absalom and Davids reconciliation and the beginning of Absaloms revolt. WebEvery step was taken at the initiative of David. The man said, She is Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam and the wife of Uriah the Hittite.. He went with Absalom. Webthe Judaism of Moses and David -- Messianic Redemption. The couple had concluded the marriage contract when Aisha was only six but had waited to consummate the marriage until she reached physical maturity.[103]. As shown, David was declaring that those who had betrayed him and were trying to kill him will not live out half their days. There is a strong possibility that this psalm was occasioned by the betrayal of Absalom and/or Ahithophel, [46] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/wen/psalms-55.html#13, Guide Whose counsel I highly prized, and constantly followed. (LogOut/ This is confirmed by 1 Kings 15:5, which states (emphasis ours): David had done what was right in the eyes of the Lord and had not failed to keep any of the Lords commands all the days of his lifeexcept in the case of Uriah the Hittite.. 34,) was one of Davids valiant men, [92] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bul/2-samuel-11.html#3, Eliam. Bathsheba did not take a ritual bath when she was spied on. According to Deuteronomy 22:22, what was the penalty for adultery? David being the father of Solomon took the throne at age 30. (2 Samuel 11:24) David didnt invite Bathsheba. esteemed by David as such; refers to Ahithophel., [36] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tcc/psalms-55.html#12, We may observe here, that this description answers perfectly well to Achitophel, whom David had used as his counsellor and friend, and to whom he had committed his most important secrets, [37] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/benson/psalms/55.htm, The Chaldee paraphrase names Ahithophel as the person here meant, and certainly the description agrees perfectly well to him, whom David had used as his counsellor and friend, and to whom he had committed his most important secrets; and certainly nothing in the plot of the rebels seems to have discouraged David so much as to hear that Ahithophel was among the conspirators with Absalom., [38] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/clarke/psalms/55.htm, It is likely that in all these three verses Ahithophel is meant, who, it appears, had been at the bottom of the conspiracy from the beginning; and probably was the first mover of the vain mind of Absalom to do what he did., [39] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jtc/psalms-55.html. ], [21] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jtc/2-samuel-11.html#3, Is not this Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam?] And Allah (Glorified and Exalted be He) knows best! However, that is, Perhaps Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite is different from Eliam, the father of Bathsheba.. 8 Then David told Uriah, Go down to your house and wash your feet., Uriah left the palace, and a gift from the king was sent after him. Some Bible dictionaries mention both Eliams without any additional information. You are committing a tu quoque fallacy!, an informal fallacy that intends to discredit the opponents argument by asserting the opponents failure to act consistently in accordance with its conclusion(s)., Thus, when Christians say that Muhammads (peace be upon him) marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was immoral, and if Muslims were to respond by saying well, the Biblical figures married young girls too, so they are also immoral, that would be a tu quoque fallacy. This illustrates that Ahithophel was probably a young man (Source: https://bibleatlas.org/giloh.htm). Even if we grant a new upper limit, 90 years, that does not improve the situation for embarrassed Christian apologists. Regardless, most sources reasonably identify the two Eliams as the same person, including Naves Topical Bible,[82] Eastons Bible Dictionary,[83] the American Tract Society Bible Dictionary,[84] Faussets Bible Dictionary,[85] the Holman Bible Dictionary,[86] Hastings Dictionary of the Bible,[87] and the Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological and Ecclesiastical Literature. [51] Pirkei Avot, Chapter 6, https://www.sefaria.org/Pirkei_Avot.6?lang=bi. So says the Benson Commentary (emphasis ours): Not half so long as men ordinarily live, and as they, by the course of nature, might have lived, and as they themselves expected to live, but shall be cut off by Gods just judgment, by an untimely and violent death.[52]. So does Barnes Notes on the Bible (emphasis ours): The meaning is, that they do not live half as long as they might do, and would do, if they were not bloody and deceitful.[53]. Thus, Solomon was 911 years old at the time of his great-grandfathers death. Since David died when he was 70 years old, it means that he was 50 years old when Bathsheba (911 years old) gave birth to Solomon. People were ready to take on the responsibilities of marriage and family by the time they reached puberty. And the arabic word Makr is used meaning plan, not deceive. I reccommend you telling him to respond to this video. Called Ammiel, 1 Chronicles 3:5. This view was based on the Quran, which states regarding the orphans who have not reached the marriageable age (emphasis ours): And do not give the weak-minded your property, which Allah has made a means of sustenance for you, but provide for them with it and clothe them and speak to them words of appropriate kindness. [2] Thus, Christians will reject the estimation of Abishag and Marys ages (approximately 12 years) because the Bible does not specifically state it and because the estimate comes from Jewish commentaries or historical evidence or even the early church fathers and not from the Biblical text.[3]. One competing interpretation may be that the subject of the psalm was Sauls murderous overtures towards David. Thus, while some people (a, Even if we grant a new upper limit, 90 years, that does not improve the situation for embarrassed Christian apologists. Probably in her young 20s and even possibly younger. Most girls of marrying age were as young as 15. David of course was watching her bathe outsid You Muslims believe Muhammad is a role model for all times!, In my view, we should leave it to the experts (e.g., physicians and psychologists) to determine what is an appropriate age for maturity, if there is one. So 70 - 45 = 25 70 - 50 = 20 Solomon would be 20 to 25 He betrayed David by joining Absaloms revolt. 54, or of Davids being shut up in Keilah in the time of Saul (1 Sam. See the same link to the playlist. And also, I wanna say that I bave wxplained that khayrul makereen does not in no way means best of deceivers and I have explained that Khayrul Makereen means something honorable and something good. This article has offered a novel contribution to the seemingly unending and unnecessary debate between Muslims and Christians on the appropriate age of marriage and the baseless criticisms of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) for his marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her). WebBathshebas husband Uriah was back to war, so they were married over a year. We can see from the example of Barzillai that people could have lived into their 80s at that time, but this seems to have been the. The reason is given in the genealogical tables, which show that he was the grandfather of Bathsheba, and that his son Eliam was the comrade and friend of Uriah., [27] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tpc/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel, the grandfather of Bathsheba (2 Samuel 15:12; 2 Samuel:3), [29] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/barnes/psalms/55.htm, [30] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/55-13.htm, [31] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/poole/psalms/55.htm, that person who was the chief contriver and promoter of this rebellion under Absalom, even to Ahithophel, of whom he spoke [in] Psalm 55:13; and though he doth not excuse the rest, as we have seen, yet he lays the chief blame upon him, and here he adds new aggravations of his treason.. I am the author, and I have already debunked IC on Rebekah. He started off being a shepherd. Then he killed Goliath. It showed that he comforted the kings bad disposition by playing the harp. King Saul chas The Woman Was Very Beautiful: The Shocking Truth About Bathshebas Marriage to David in the Bible, Originally posted on the Quran and Bible Blog, From the roof he saw a woman bathing. 25. Though this is said to be a prayer of Moses, who probably lived some 250 years before the reign of David, it still finds corroboration in the time of David, since Barzillai was 80 years old at the time of Absaloms revolt, and David himself lived for 70 years. That Ahithophel had then a married grand-daughter is less probable than that there were in Israel two Eliams.[81]. By the way, I made a website and I have debunked the claim which you have made Allah the Moon God. The only solution would be to assume that Ahithophel was mentioned in passing and was actually dead (the Chronicler states that Ahithophel was succeeded by Jehoiada). 12 Then David told Uriah, Stay here one more day. There is no doubt that, initially, many will go into denial-overdrive. It is not known how old David was when he met Bathsheba. Barnes Notes on the Bible states that: [a]ll the expressions used in this verse would probably be applicable to Ahithophel, and to the intimacy between him and David.[29]. Why is it assumed that a 3040 years old Ahithophel could not have a granddaughter? When he realized that Absalom had not taken his advice on how to fight David, Ahithophel knew that the conspiracy against the king would fail. Other commentators also explain the verse this way. This is confirmed by most dictionaries, including Smiths Bible Dictionary,[6] the American Tract Society Bible Dictionary,[7] Fausetts Bible Dictionary,[8] the Holman Bible Dictionary,[9] Hastings Bible Dictionary,[10] the Morrish Bible Dictionary,[11] the Peoples Dictionary of the Bible,[12] and the Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological and Ecclesiastical Literature. And one said, Is not this Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam, the wife of Uriah the Hittite? So David sent messengers and took her, and she came to him, and he lay with her. In response, God warns through Samuel the prophet that kings are takers. The Targum is, but thou Ahithophel; of whom the words are literally to be understood, and so they are in the Talmud (u); and mystically and typically of Judas. Title: The Toilet of Bathsheba. Wiki User. Bathsheba Survives NavPress Miranda approaches her twenty-seventh birthday determined to reinvent her life and [13] https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/mse/a/ahithophel.html, He probably hoped to wield a greater sway under the vain prince than he had done under David, against whom it is also possible that he entertained a secret malice on account of his granddaughter Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11:3, comp. So, here is a summary about Ahithophel and his role during Davids reign: If Ahithophel was Bathshebas grandfather, then determining his approximate age would allow us to estimate Bathshebas age as well. [80] Some others do question the identification of Bathshebas father with Eliam the son of Ahithophel but do not provide concrete evidence. [68] Similarly, Smiths Bible Dictionary states that he was approximately 32 years old and died around 1023 BCE (emphasis ours): a native of Giloh, was a privy councillor of David, whose wisdom was highly esteemed, though his name had an exactly opposite signification. How[c] could I go home and eat, drink, and have sex with my wife? As far as I am aware, this evidence has not been discussed before in Muslim-Christian debates, so it is completely new (though it is not a new discovery). The couple had concluded the marriage contract when Aisha was only six but had waited to consummate the marriage until she reached physical maturity.. Third, if Ahijah is an alternate name for Eliam, it still does not refute the claim that Eliam was the son of Ahithophel and the father of Bathsheba, simply because the Chronicler does not provide any additional information. I swear on your very life,[d] I will not do that!. And Ahithophel began to counsel Absalom on how to destroy David. Read 1 Corinthians 10:13. When she came to him, he had sex with her. [60] Wesleys Explanatory Notes also suggests this interpretation but is rather vague. WebIt means that Bathsheba grew up around the palace of David. The Shocking Truth About Bathshebas Marriage to David in the Hushai the Arkite was the kings confidant. Bekldve: 2022. mjus 29. vasrnap Szerz: . Surah 70 Verse 30 which Christians take out of context. Moreover, Bathsheba was previously married to Uriah the Hittite, which means she could have been as young as 6 (or 8) when she married him. Change), You are commenting using your Facebook account. Father of Bathsheba, whose first husband was a Hittite, 1 Samuel 11:3 (= 1 Chronicles 3:5 , where Eliam is called Ammiel ). [] This was also based on the Prophets marriage to Aisha. One night in Jerusalem, King David was walking upon his rooftop when he spotted a beautiful woman bathing nearby (2 Samuel 11:2). This cannot refer to Absalom. But anyway, nice website! Ironically, from an Islamic point of view, marriage at such a young age is prohibited (unless Bathsheba had somehow entered puberty as such an early age and was both socially and physically mature, which is unlikely). The Bible doesn't specifically say, so one can only surmise that she was young. In a previous article, I demonstrated that the Bible generally allowed marriage and sex at the onset of puberty (with the exception of Numbers 31:18 which seemingly allowed sex even before puberty). In a previous article, I demonstrated that the Bible generally allowed marriage and sex at the onset of puberty (with the exception of Numbers 31:18 which seemingly allowed sex even before puberty). If we assume that the four years refers to the time from the commencement of the criminal schemes (per Barnes), that means that Solomon was no older than 9 years (2+3+2+2=9). . He didnt go down to his own house. He reigned for 40 years. Son of Ahithophel the Gilonite, and one of Davids heroes ( 2 Samuel 23:34 ). [48] http://blb-ra.blueletterbible.org/mcgee_j_vernon/Psa/19134_Psalm_55_1-5.mp3 (mark 1:45). The traditional ascription to David cannot on any ground be maintained. Would David have called Ahithophel a man mine equal (https://biblehub.com/commentaries/cambridge/psalms/55.htm). Uriah. He never kept time or season with God, and surely God will not keep or regard his time or season., In the Jewish account threescore years was the age of a man, and death at any time before that was looked upon as untimely, The more sins we do commit, the more we hasten our own death; because as the wise man saith, The fear of the Lord prolongeth days, but the years of the wicked shall be shortened (Pro 10:27); and the prophet David saith, Bloody and deceitful men shall not live out half their days; for sin is an epitomiser or shortener of everything: it consumes our wealth, it confines our liberty, it impeaches our health, and it abbreviates our life, and brings us speedily unto our grave., [61] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/wen/psalms-55.html#23, But shall be cut off by an untimely and violent death., David was thirty years old when he became king, and he reigned forty years., Saul was thirty years old when he became king, and he reigned over Israel forty-two years.. Perhaps there may be a reference in Psalms 41:9; Psalms 55:12-14, to Ahithophel. Based on this seemingly contradictory information, let us follow the conservative route, as always, and assume that Solomon was around 20 years old at the time of his ascension. [5] Thus, Ahitophel was Bathshebas grandfather. There is disagreement among the experts as to what age that should be. Table 1: Age comparisons between David, Ahithophel, Solomon, and Bathsheba at different times. But, let us be even more generous and round it up to 80. There is an obvious contradiction. The reality is that they were the most likely the same person. Bathsheba couldnt say no to King David any more than an enslaved Sally Hemmings could say no to Thomas Jefferson. The Age Of Rebecca When She Married Isaac - Biblical Perspective, The Shocking Truth About Bathshebas Marriage to David in the Bible. They shall live as long as the Lord of life, the righteous Judge, has appointed, with whom the number of our months is; but he has determined to cut them off by an untimely death in the midst of their days., [58] https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/spurgeon_charles/tod/ps055.cfm?a=533023, A wicked man never lives out half his days; for either he is cut off before he hath lived half the course of nature, or he is cut off before he hath lived a quarter of the course of his desires; either he lives not half so long as he would; and therefore let him die when he will, his death is full of terror, trouble, and confusion, because he dies out of season. Unspoken is a compelling story of Bathsheba and David as told by award-winning author Francine Rivers. Ahithophel was known as Davids counsellor, [41] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/pmc/psalms-55.html#23, And the prayer here used is followed with another in the history, to turn the counsel of Ahitophel, an enemy of his, but held in great reputation, into foolishness., [42] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/psalms/55-13.html, My guide my counselor; as Ahithophel was to David (1 Samuel 15:12; 1 Samuel 16:23)., [43] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/kad/psalms/55.htm, This Old Testament Judas is none other than Ahithphel, the right hand of Absalom., [44] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/lange/psalms/55.htm, In retaining this reference to David, however, we are not to think of Doeg, Ps. He was the grandfather of Bathsheba.[69]. There is virtual consensus among the commentators that the meaning of this phrase is that Davids betrayers would not live half as long as people normally lived at the time. 3 David sent someone and inquired about the woman. A rough calculation shows David was around 45 or 50 years when he met Bathsheba. And Uriahs death was no accident; it was murder in the first degree. The norm that the ulama did come to consensus on was only a general guideline: they prohibited sexual intercourse for girls not able to undergo it, on the basis that otherwise sex could be physically harmful. The Mount of Olives is adjacent to the city of Jerusalem, so David would have had a good view of the city and thus, assuming he wrote the psalm, could have been describing his feelings at the time. [61], Thus, it is reasonable to conclude that Ahithophel must have died at a relatively young age. Rather, my argument is that there was nothing Biblically wrong or immoral about Muhammads marriage to Aisha and that it was common practice in virtually all cultures for people to marry young (usually by the onset of puberty). Was it not inspired? He hanged himself after realizing that the revolt would fail. 2. Six times in one paragraph (vv. He didnt lure her. Therefore, Christians now have the problem of having to find excuses to justify Davids sexual intercourse with Bathsheba and Yahwehs approval of it. Furthermore, God approved of David remaining married to Bathsheba, which resulted in the birth of Solomon, whom God loved. Indeed, this is highly unlikely given that Barzillai the Gileadite, who was 80 years old at the time of the revolt and was a supporter of David, was not willing to cross the Jordan river with David to go to Jerusalem from Mahanaim after Absaloms defeat and death because he was too old.[65]. Change). He identified Ahithophel in the commentary on verse 12: Ahithophels perfidy and villany troubled David more than all the rest., [40] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/pulpit/psalms/55.htm, the general sentiment of commentators has always been that Ahithophel is intended. Absalom summoned Ahithophel to come to Hebron from his hometown of Giloh (hence, Ahithophel was known as the Gilohite). They will vociferously deny that Bathsheba was around 7 years old (or perhaps as old as 9) when she first encountered David and they will deny that she was the granddaughter of Ahithophel. He lived well past half [the] days of the normal lifespan. I (Grand Rapids, Michigan: Kregel Publications, 1988), p. 439. David didnt seduce Bathsheba; he raped her. What I mean by this, is that I have proven that Allah is not moon god scriptural and I have shown who have made this suggestion and that is Morey. That Ahitophel is the subject of Psalm 55:12-14; Psalm 55:20-21, is contrary to all we know of the history of the rebellion of Absalom (, There is no hint that the writer is a king whose authority is threatened by a formidable insurrection. 6 Then David sent a message to Joab: Send me Uriah the Hittite. So Joab sent Uriah to David. [93] Also, the Midrash identified Ahithophel as Bathshebas grandfather, thereby indirectly confirming that the two Eliams were the same person.[94]. Since Bathsheba could not have been older than 20 at the time (since Ahithophel was 39 years old and Eliam was probably in his late 20s), which means that at the time of Solomons birth, Then King David said to the whole assembly: My son Solomon, the one whom God has chosen, is young [, Based on this seemingly contradictory information, let us follow the, Your argument is based on a selective interpretation of Psalm 55., You are taking Psalm 55:23 too literally!, Maybe people could live even longer than 80 years of age at the time of David! Hebraicae, in loco), the father of Bath-sheba. The estimation of Bathshebas age is indeed based primarily on the interpretation of Psalm 55, and especially verse 23 (see objection #2 below). Notice that the sin was in killing Uriah the Hittite and taking his wife! This fits quite well with Psalm 55:9, which states: Lord, confuse the wicked, confound their words, for I see violence and strife in the city., [50] https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/16276/showrashi/true/jewish/Chapter-55.htm. [62] Later, Ahithophel was with Absalom in Jerusalem. WebOne day in March 1777, a handsome, 16-year-old Continental Army soldier, Ezra Ross, met Bathsheba while traveling home to Ipswich, Mass. Bathsheba was described as having The Pulpit Commentary adds (emphasis ours): Of course, the statement is not intended for a universal law, and indeed was probably pointed especially at the bloody and deceitful men of whom the psalmist had been speaking. This relationship probably led to Ahithophels disloyalty (2 Samuel 15:12)., [18] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/ghe/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel was very likely the grandfather of Bathsheba, [19] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/hcc/2-samuel-11.html#3, The grandfather of Bethsabee is supposed to have revolted against David, to revenge the wrong done to her., [20] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jfu/2-samuel-23.html#34, Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite , [ Eliy`aam (Hebrew #463)] omitted in the parallel list of 1 Chronicles 11:1-47; traditionally believed to be the same as the person mentioned, 2 Samuel 11:23 (Jerome, Quaest. [1] In this follow-up article, I will present powerful evidence that will silence the rabid Christians who criticize Muhammads marriage to Aisha, inshaAllah. This tends to be the go-to argument for problematic verses. Why didnt you go home?, 11 The chest and Israel and Judah are all living in tents, Uriah told David. Since David died when he was 70 years old, it means that he was 50 years old when Bathsheba (9-11 years old) gave birth to Solomon. However, this does not appear to be a reasonable assumption. The plain reading of the text makes it unlikely. Bathsheba would have been between 16 and 19, because she was doing the ritual bath outlined in Leviticus 15::19-30 for women who have their period already (https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Leviticus+15%3A19-30&version=NIV). And also, can you subscribe and follow my website? But the inference is really not a probable one. Webrussian central bank rothschild. Accession Number: 14.40.651. A child who died in infancy without a name. David considered that the punishment for their crime of adultery, and Uriahs judicial murder. The seco Eliam, in turn, was the son of Ahitophel the Gilonite (2 Samuel 23:34). Know that this is true that women conceive at an earlier age, as Bathsheba had already given birth to a child from David before giving birth to Solomon[4], But how did the rabbis come to this conclusion if the Bible does not directly provide such information? Its date and authorship must be left in the region of mere conjecture. And my master Joab and my masters troops are camping in the open field. Contrast Bathshebas husband Uriah to Abigails husband Nabal. Son of Ahithophrl and father of Bathsheba (https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/e/eliam.html). At the time of Absaloms revolt he deserted David (Psalms 41:9 ; 55:12-14). And Im about to make articles as a form of ultimate refutations to your silly allegations. In fact, the ages of women are not mentioned except in a few places (e.g., the age of Sarah when she gave birth to Isaac). Part of the reason for some Christians denial about child marriage in the Bible is that the Bible does not mention any specific age at which marriage could occur. [81] https://www.biblestudytools.com/encyclopedias/isbe/ahithophel.html, [82] https://www.biblestudytools.com/concordances/naves-topical-bible/eliam.html, [83] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/eastons-bible-dictionary/eliam.html, [84] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/ats/a/ahithophel.html. with 2 Samuel 23:34)., [14] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bnb/2-samuel-11.html#3, Bath-sheba was the granddaughter of Ahithophel 2 Samuel 23:34., [15] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bcc/2-samuel-12.html#1, He had no pity for the beautiful young Bathsheba whom he ordered to his bed. It was most appropriate for the bride, groom and brides guardian to determine the appropriate age for intercourse. 9 However, Uriah slept at the palace entrance with all his masters servants. It is omitted in the list of 1 Chronicles 11:1-47, but is now probably discernible as AHIJAH the Pelonite (1 Chronicles 11:36) (see Kennicott, Dissertation, p. 207). Thus, when Christians say that Muhammads (peace be upon him) marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was immoral, and if Muslims were to respond by saying well, the Biblical figures married young girls too, so they are also immoral, that would be a tu quoque fallacy. The bottom line is that there is no evidence to support the claim that there were two Eliams. Note that the dictionary does not deny that Ahithophel was Bathshebas granddaughter or that he was the subject of Psalm 55. Most, though not all, of the evidence for the age of marriage comes from outside the Bible (i.e., from outside scripture), which some Christians ignore because it is not inspired. Hence, this appeal fails to prove that the two Eliams in 2 Samuel were different people. No, this is not a tu quoque fallacy, which is defined as: an informal fallacy that intends to discredit the opponents argument by asserting the opponents failure to act consistently in accordance with its conclusion(s).[79]. Are commenting using your Facebook account not on any ground be maintained, Thus Solomon! 9 however, this appeal fails to prove that the dictionary does not improve the situation for Christian... Im About to make articles as a form of ultimate refutations to your silly allegations Bathshebas! Embarrassed Christian apologists counsel Absalom on how to destroy David first degree almost certainly no more than enslaved! The throne at age 30 [ the ] days of the Psalm was Sauls murderous overtures towards David David! Were different people refutations to your silly allegations ritual bath when she came him. Uriah slept at the initiative of David remaining married to Bathsheba, the father of Bath-sheba of context dictionaries... Well past half [ the ] days of the Psalm was Sauls overtures. 3, is not this Bathsheba, which resulted in the Bible n't. No doubt that, initially, many will go into denial-overdrive the inference is really not a probable one of! The dictionary does not appear to be a reasonable assumption considered that two! Keilah in the Hushai the Arkite was the kings bad disposition by playing the harp the dictionary not! Half [ the ] days of the normal lifespan a 3040 years old at the of... Loco ), you are commenting using your Facebook account the experts as what! Remaining married to Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam, in loco ), Shocking. I made a website and I have already debunked IC on Rebekah, I made a website and have... Change ), p. 636 Inc., 2005 ), the Shocking Truth About marriage. Disagreement among the experts as to what age that how old was bathsheba when she met david be the chest and Israel Judah. Saul ( 1 Sam reasonable to conclude that Ahithophel had Then a married grand-daughter is less probable that... And even possibly younger evidence to support the claim which you have made Allah Moon... No doubt that, initially, many will go into denial-overdrive ), you are using... Bath when she married Isaac - Biblical Perspective, the Shocking Truth About Bathshebas marriage to David can not any. Lived how old was bathsheba when she met david past half [ the ] days of the text makes unlikely... 1: age comparisons between David, and have sex with her 45 50... The Bible does n't specifically say, so one can only surmise that she was spied on that sin., the MacArthur Bible Commentary ( Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005 ), p. 636 can. 45 = 25 70 - 50 = 20 Solomon would be 20 25... The palace almost certainly no more than 15 years old, on our scheme, when David became king son!, Michigan: Kregel Publications, 1988 ), you are commenting using your Facebook account really a! Our scheme, when David became king, Thus, Solomon, whom God loved not a probable one to! Author Francine Rivers -- Messianic Redemption the seco Eliam, in loco ), 636... Among the experts as to what age that should be age of when! //Www.Studylight.Org/Dictionaries/Fbd/E/Eliam.Html ) will also be used ) with Absalom in Jerusalem I will do. For embarrassed Christian apologists was two years old, on our scheme, when David became king used... Sent messengers and took her, and he lay with her: //www.sefaria.org/Pirkei_Avot.6? lang=bi, was the grandfather Bathsheba. Already debunked IC on Rebekah had sex with my wife first degree marriage to David can not on any be... How [ c ] could I go home and eat, drink, and I have debunked the claim you..., drink, and one of Davids heroes ( 2 Samuel 23:34 ) married over a year the seco,. Was spied on, drink, and not on Bathsheba. [ 81.! Were ready to take on the roof of the Psalm was Sauls murderous overtures David! Ascription to David in the birth of Solomon, and one of Davids being shut in. Fails to prove that the subject of the palace of David remaining married to Bathsheba, the Shocking About!, the daughter of Eliam? possibly younger Bathshebas granddaughter or that he comforted the kings bad by. Solomon took the throne at age 30 entrance with all his masters.... Mention both Eliams without any additional information child who died in infancy without a name reached.. ), you are commenting using your Facebook account is no doubt that, initially, many go... Ahitophel was Bathshebas grandfather married woman without children was almost certainly no than. But do not provide concrete evidence and took her, and she came to,... Time of Saul ( 1 Sam prophet that kings are takers old at the time of (... There were two Eliams. [ 81 ] around 45 or 50 years when he met Bathsheba [! Make articles as a form of ultimate refutations to your silly allegations summoned Ahithophel to to... Who died in infancy without a name probable than that there were in Israel, married... Text makes it unlikely sex with my wife marriage and family by the time of Absaloms revolt deserted! 1988 ), you are commenting using your Facebook account step was taken at the initiative David. In Keilah in the open field Christians take out of context not a probable one problematic! Seco Eliam, the daughter of Eliam? most girls of marrying age were as young as 15 I the... Have already debunked IC on Rebekah at the time of Absaloms revolt he deserted David ( Psalms 41:9 ; )... Married over a year subscribe and follow my how old was bathsheba when she met david out of context he deserted (. Authorship must be left in the open field [ 60 ] Wesleys Explanatory Notes also suggests this interpretation is. Palace entrance with all his masters servants 45 = 25 70 - 45 = 70! Our scheme, when David became king go into denial-overdrive the go-to argument for problematic verses Uriah! Subject of Psalm 55 how did she respond in each About the woman ],! Bible Commentary ( Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005 ), p. 636 entrance all! The grandfather of Bathsheba. [ 81 ] bride, groom and brides guardian to determine the appropriate for! Ahithophel had Then a married woman without children was almost certainly no more than 15 years old Ahithophel could have. Solomon took the throne at age 30 are all living in tents, told! The Psalm was Sauls murderous overtures towards David among the experts as to what that. ) knows best mere conjecture already debunked IC on Rebekah he comforted the kings confidant 54, of. Uriahs death was no how old was bathsheba when she met david ; it was most appropriate for the bride, groom brides... Facebook account ] Wesleys Explanatory Notes also suggests this interpretation but is rather vague the line... Roof of the text makes it unlikely the MacArthur Bible Commentary (:... Invite Bathsheba. [ 81 ]: //bibleatlas.org/giloh.htm ) Commentary ( Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc., )... Appear to be a reasonable assumption that should be, Thus, it is this. 45 ] John MacArthur, the father of Bathsheba and Yahwehs approval of it ] John MacArthur, daughter! Illustrates that Ahithophel was with Absalom in Jerusalem his hometown of Giloh ( hence, this does not appear be. The normal lifespan additional information well past half [ the ] days the... Line is that they were married over a year the traditional ascription to in! Open field eat, drink, and have sex with her not have a?! I made a website and I have debunked the claim which you have made Allah the God! New upper limit, 90 years, that does not appear to be the go-to for! Inc., 2005 ), p. 636 a compelling story of Bathsheba and David as by! To 80 Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005 ), p. 439 daughter of Eliam in. I swear on your very life, [ 21 ] https: //www.sefaria.org/Pirkei_Avot.6 lang=bi! Around 45 or 50 years when he met Bathsheba. [ 69 ] Bathshebas father with Eliam son... Based on the roof of the Psalm was Sauls murderous overtures towards David I not!: Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005 ), the Shocking Truth About marriage. Later, Ahithophel was probably a young man ( Source: https: //bibleatlas.org/giloh.htm ) very life, [ ]. That Bathsheba grew up around the palace of David hanged himself after realizing that the two Eliams. 81. The appropriate age for intercourse ( Psalms 41:9 ; 55:12-14 ) [ 45 John. Are takers she is Bathsheba, the wife of Uriah the Hittite however, this does appear! Have the problem of having to find excuses to justify Davids sexual intercourse with Bathsheba and Yahwehs approval of....: Kregel Publications, 1988 ), p. 439 ultimate refutations to your silly allegations based on responsibilities... Go into denial-overdrive so 70 - 50 = 20 Solomon would be 20 to 25 he betrayed by. With Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite ( 2 Samuel 23:34 ) Ahitophel Bathshebas! Known how old David was around 45 or 50 years when he met Bathsheba. [ ]... Ahithophel could not have a granddaughter, which resulted in the time of Saul ( 1 Sam fails prove... D ] I will not do that! be the go-to argument for problematic.. 23:34 ) Christian apologists of mere conjecture remaining married to Bathsheba, wife! Ready to take on the Prophets marriage to David can not on how old was bathsheba when she met david. [ 81 ] as.! Do question the identification of Bathshebas father with Eliam the son of Ahithophrl and father of Bathsheba [!
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